My Mazamet

Life at № 42

The World in Which a Dead Son Is Better Than a Gay Son

I’d rather have a dead son than a gay son.
Let that phrase wash over you. Let it envelop you. Let it sink in. Taste its bitter sting. A dead son, is better, than a gay son. Dead better than gay.

Now imagine being a child hearing that: a little boy who’s just that little bit different from the other little boys. The way he walks is just that little bit different; the way he talks is just that little bit different – even the way he crosses his legs is just that little bit different, just enough that it makes him stand out. At first, he’s too young to understand what any of that could mean, but he hears the subtle whispers and he sees the not-so-subtle nudges. Then at a certain age the playground taunts begin. Girl, sissy, fag. Along with the taunts comes fear. He’s frightened because he’s already started to understand that to many people in the world he inhabits a dead son is better than a gay son.

He will learn, through coded and uncoded messages, received a million times a day, that he lives in a binary society, one where you are dominant or dominated, predator or prey, worthy or worthless, male or female. The gay sons, the gay boys, the gay men, they – well, we – are singled out for exclusion. We are objects of scorn, derision and contempt: better off gone. Better off dead. The situation is compounded because we aren’t the only ones receiving the message. All the other little boys and little girls, cousins, brothers, and sisters are receiving it too, and that message informs the way they look at us. It factors into the calculation of how they feel about us. It helps determine our place in our family, in our circle of friends, in the world. Dead better than gay.

By early adolescence I already felt completely isolated from everything and everyone around me. Terrified of what might come. Trapped and alone. If it turns out you really are gay, that’s bad. If you admit it, that’s admitting to being bad. If you don’t admit it, you’re a liar. If you deceive yourself, you’re just postponing being bad. No matter how you play this hand, you are going to lose. A dead son is better than a gay son. Dead better than gay.

By late adolescence dead better than gay is a sentiment you’ve spent most of your life seeing in your parents’ eyes. Hearing in your grandparents’ voices; And feeling from the family members and friends who either embrace, justify or excuse the disdain aimed at society’s gay sons. And at one point you can’t take it anymore. You break. You stop believing affection directed towards you can be real. People can’t love you. They can’t even like you, because all they see is this shell of a creature you’ve become. Frozen, paralysed, hiding from yourself and the world around you. Desperate not to be the gay son, because a dead son is better than a gay son.

The consequences of people, families and societies promoting this mindset are dire, because the scars left behind are indelible. Human beings get destroyed. Families get destroyed. Trust me, I speak from experience.

In the next few days the people of Brazil will vote for their new president. Built into that choice are two very different worlds. One where every citizen has value, and another where a dead son is better than a gay son.

Which side will you be on?

If you want to see the devastating real life consequences of anti-lgbt sentiment in Brazil visit: https://homofobiamata.wordpress.com/

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192 comments on “The World in Which a Dead Son Is Better Than a Gay Son

  1. Tish Farrell
    October 26, 2018

    No words really, just bottomless sorrow. How is it that the life-denying socio-psychopaths still gather so much power!

    Liked by 6 people

    • The Pink Agendist
      October 26, 2018

      I think we’ve just learnt, as a society, to pretend it isn’t so. After all Bosnia and Rwanda happened before our eyes.

      Liked by 5 people

      • Tish Farrell
        October 26, 2018

        Indeed. And it was all their own fault too – nothing to do with us, guv.

        Liked by 3 people

  2. Bizzy
    October 26, 2018

    Well, the scary thing is that in Brazil, Saudi Arabia and a few other places, somebody might actually kill you and get away with it. But for most of us, fortunately, that is not the case. And it may take a whole lot of therapy — the Jungians were my shrink of choice — but scars can heal. The day I realized that I would never please everybody, certainly never please most of my family, and that this freed me to spend my life with the people with whom I did get along, was invaluable. What I being to the world is of value to the people I value and who value me. Everyone else is irrelevant.

    Liked by 6 people

    • The Pink Agendist
      October 26, 2018

      I’m afraid I might not be as strong as that. Years of therapy behind me and the best I’ve managed is to lock myself away in my own world – which I love, but I’m aware it’s a bubble.

      Liked by 2 people

      • Kris Jennings
        October 26, 2018

        You are stronger than you give yourself credit. You share (from your bubble) and influence change through the very act of blogging.

        Liked by 7 people

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 26, 2018

        It’s interesting, isn’t it – the difference between what the rational mind knows versus how we feel 🙂

        Liked by 4 people

      • Bizzy
        October 26, 2018

        Of course it’s a bubble. I think we all live in bubbles. I think it’s important to be okay with that. See it for what it is, of course, lest you take it too seriously, but then let it go. It’s a long time since I actually read any Jung, but wasn’t that his goal? He didn’t « cure. » He made folks comfortable with their own madness. He called it individuation. I guess some of us are more individuated than others.

        I can’t see the other comment in this thread right now, but I agree that you may be stronger than you may think. From where I sit, it appears you have a supportive primary relationship, a drop-dead gorgeous house and a profession that helps you keep it all going. In these fractious times, those are solid accomplishments.

        Courage. You have more people on your side than you may realize.

        Liked by 4 people

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 26, 2018

        I remember individuation!!! And how we’re making our place in the world until our 40’s and then spend the rest of our lives deciding if that place is good enough! I think it’s time to go book hunting upstairs.
        I do try to talk myself into acceptance regularly, but I also slip just as regularly.

        Liked by 4 people

  3. Esme upon the Cloud
    October 26, 2018

    Many have committed suicide for this very reason — things are changing, but painfully slow. I deem those who propagate such poisonous words to be just that — they poison our planet and they are killers, even if someone doesn’t take their life they often lose the life they could have had, just as you describe. I hope people vote against him and his ilk worldwide, words such as yours are so powerful. A heart-wrenching post beautifully written dear.

    – Esme Cloud ❤

    Liked by 10 people

    • The Pink Agendist
      October 26, 2018

      The damage done is profound. I know I’ll never have relationships in the way other people do. I’ll never have friends like other people do. Never open up, never let my guard down. And that takes a lot of effort which is why I only expose myself to the outside world in short bursts, before I come running back to safety.

      Liked by 4 people

  4. Swarn Gill
    October 26, 2018

    I can’t add much, because you said it all quite well, and it is much more impactful coming from your mouth than mine anyway, having lived it. As Esme said above, the “pray the gay away” mentality is much the same mentality. That feeling of being trapped has led to many committing suicide, because there is the physically dead, and having your parents treat you as if you were. As if you didn’t matter. As a father, I cannot even fathom a “love” that has such conditions. To talk about homosexuality being not natural and in the same breath thinking it’s natural to wish your son dead for just being who he is. Well that just takes up some pretty fucked up religious and/or hyper-masculinity indoctrination to get there. Some ideas are so toxic, it’s painful to watch them persist.

    Liked by 7 people

    • The Pink Agendist
      October 26, 2018

      “Well that just takes up some pretty fucked up religious and/or hyper-masculinity indoctrination to get there.”
      Bingo. The mindset is drilled into people from the time they’re able to breathe. I should have expanded on the binary and worthy/worthless categories as it’s a system that consumes everything. Black vs. white, rich vs. poor, violent vs. pacifist.

      Liked by 3 people

  5. jim-
    October 26, 2018

    I’m in small town Washington, and the gay kids are open about it and accepted. My daughters best friend who stays here twice a week on average is lesbian. She is well liked and a leader at school. My adopted daughter is a senior, openly bi and has no issues from anyone. Times are a changin’ I hope. Is this an anomaly here? Am I in a bubble?
    Pink this is powerfully written! Comfort to you with all my love and empathy. That was difficult to read (and write I bet). So sorry man. I used to be part of that crap. Religion is cancer.

    Liked by 6 people

    • jim-
      October 26, 2018

      ps, I have no idea how the boys fare in this. I’ll ask the girls and see what they know.

      Liked by 2 people

    • The Pink Agendist
      October 26, 2018

      I’m thrilled to see how much the world has changed in many places. Here too I say young gay students walking the streets being openly gay and seemingly completely at ease with the world and themselves. That makes what’s about to happen in Brazil all the more frightening.

      Liked by 3 people

      • jim-
        October 26, 2018

        I Did talk to the girls just now. There is only one openly gay male and he’s doing well according to them. No bullying or name calling that they know. He’s well liked. What’s concerning is there are about 100 boys at the school. Statistically someone is in hiding. This is a quite right-wing religious area. Parental influence perhaps?

        Liked by 4 people

  6. john zande
    October 26, 2018

    Lovely, frightening post.

    The choice here on Sunday is absolutely appalling. Vote for the party you loathe, the party that has over 16 years systematically ruined every gain and ounce of stability won by FHC, or vote for a mentally unhinged lunatic who is about as bright as a house brick.

    Liked by 6 people

  7. makagutu
    October 26, 2018

    I think all bases have been covered already. The thought that someone who wants to be president can say such things and not feel any shame is disturbing. Trump said he could kill someone in main Street & get away with it & there was no consequence. It comes from this same place that Bolsonaro can say such and hope there will be no consequence

    Liked by 3 people

  8. inspiredbythedivine1
    October 26, 2018

    Like Sandra Bullock once said to her hairdresser, Sally Underpants, “Sally, the world is going fucking backward! I swear, these hate-filled nutters running for high political offices across the globe are gonna bring about a turbulent, war-torn world very, very soon. OUCH! Be careful with that curling iron! I’ve gotta use that ear to hear outta!”

    Liked by 4 people

    • The Pink Agendist
      October 26, 2018

      The danger with snake oil salesmen is that eventually when people start noticing the snake oil didn’t cure anything, they’ll do anything they need to do to hold on to power. No matter the consequences. Just look at Venezuela.

      Liked by 6 people

  9. Robert A. Vella
    October 26, 2018

    This is the danger posed by social unrest. When the people feel their livelihood is going backwards, they will reject rational common sense and resort to extreme measures. It is how despots like Hitler, Trump, and Bolsonaro rise to power.

    Liked by 3 people

    • The Pink Agendist
      October 26, 2018

      The unusual case in Brazil is despite the crisis, there’s been enormous progress reducing poverty levels. John Z. probably knows the specifics better than me, but from 30 years ago to now the country’s been transformed.

      Liked by 2 people

      • Robert A. Vella
        October 26, 2018

        No doubt. But, perception can be much more important than reality. People have short memories, and if they feel their livelihood slipping away, then it doesn’t matter what happened in the past. It’s basic sociology.

        Liked by 2 people

  10. dpmonahan
    October 27, 2018

    People say this stuff until they actually have a gay son (or friend or relative.) It isn’t real for them until then.

    Liked by 4 people

    • The Pink Agendist
      October 27, 2018

      At that point much of the damage is already done. The gay person internalised the message – the insecurity is a part of them. The barrier to trusting other people is up.

      Liked by 3 people

    • Jonathan
      October 27, 2018

      Before the people realize their son or someone close to them is gay. The gay person would already be aware of the hostile views his or her family have about gay people and the psychological damage that would cause is profound

      Liked by 3 people

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 27, 2018

        Exactly! People often think of homophobia (or misogyny or racism) as a matter of phrases/words or individual acts. That’s far from the truth. In reality homophobia and its counterparts are cycles. They begin with the idea of marginalization and inferiorization, “they are less than”; that’s expressed in a manner of ways and eventually develops into some form of violence. Sometimes emotional, others psychological and unfortunately even physical.

        Liked by 3 people

  11. Bela Johnson
    October 27, 2018

    You know, this is one more example of how a broad-based liberal arts education is crucial to the sanity of the world. One need only read Homer or any Greek myth, for that matter. History repeats itself again and again from east to west, from antiquity on. Gay men and lesbian women have existed since the dawning of recorded history. What on earth is homophobia about, but one’s own repressed bisexuality? I may have a preference to be heterosexual, but I own my duality. Accepting differences in one another is salve to our wounded humanity.

    Liked by 5 people

    • The Pink Agendist
      October 27, 2018

      Social Dominance Theory explains the phenomena pretty well. Everything humans can co-opt and transform into a tool for establishing status in a group is used precisely for that purpose. And the whole size/aggression/masculinity markers are straight from our jungle ancestors.

      Liked by 4 people

  12. MELewis
    October 27, 2018

    What a terrifying we world we (still) live in. Here I was thinking that sort of nonsense was mostly behind us (my world view right now is based on season 3 of Transparent). It’s hard to imagine such ignorance exists. I am so sorry you suffered for your sexuality but happy you have been able to create a bubble in which to be well. We all build walls to protect ourselves from the ‘others’ we fear, or who fear us. In political terms, it is different and far more dangerous. Fingers crossed our friends in Brazil will do the right thing. x

    Liked by 3 people

    • The Pink Agendist
      October 27, 2018

      Every 19 hours an LGBT person is murdered in Brazil with their sexual orientation/identity being a motivating factor in the crime.
      That means apart from the proportional 10% dying as part of the murder epidemic (6,400 of 64,000 deaths per year), you tack on a good few hundred deaths based on anti-lgbt hate. Based on a culture where a dead son is better than a gay son.

      Liked by 4 people

      • tildeb
        October 27, 2018

        I know the post is about an election but there’s another element to this I want to comment about. This homophobia on such blatant display may explain the very high rates of transsexuals in many Latin American countries (already coming to a community near you). I also think there’s a significant homophobic religious component hard at work here: better a transitioned child than a homosexual or lesbian adult, apparently.

        So I find it fascinating (sadly, let me be clear) how transactivism has piggybacked on the gay/lesbian success in some Western countries (meaning the dawning realization by the majority that aversion therapy and criminalizing same sex attraction is a bust because sexuality is innate) only to fracture this trust when medical intervention is advocated by transactivists because it can alter same sex element of sexual attraction. This advocacy for transitioning children that is sweeping the West does nothing but harm the host body, so to speak, the legal and social acceptance of same sex attraction itself. If this view is correct, I predict transactivists will begin to target gays and lesbians specifically as ‘the enemy’ and gain some measure of support by playing on the homophobia of parents! What do you think, Pink?

        Liked by 1 person

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 27, 2018

        Your attraction to hornet nests is fascinating!

        I don’t see the trans-movement as a single thing. Just like the gay movement isn’t a single thing. I was, for example, for removing gender terms from laws and contracts as the (best) path to legalise gay marriage rather than modifying the marriage contract on its own to allow for gays.
        It’s an important difference because then we are all simply citizen A or B, signing contract X or Z. Gender as a means for the government to decide what contract I can sign and with whom is an absurd notion. In other words citizens with XY chromosomes can’t sign partnership agreements with other citizens with XY chromosomes?
        But back to your question. Iran is a frightening example of a place where sexuality is seen in the binary I mention. The consequence is that in some cases gay men are pushed into it because it seems to be the only option: https://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-29832690

        As for children transitioning and all that, I imagine it depends a lot on the country. Last week I had a fairly heated discussion at the pharmacy when the pharmacist interrogated me on how much allergy medication I took. Yes, cetirizine (over the counter) allergy medication. So no chance of an opioid epidemic here where medication is tightly monitored. I have the impression control on changing gender is even tougher. Now in countries like America where people pay privately for things… I can see the door opening to a whole world of unscrupulous people ready to take advantage.

        Liked by 1 person

      • tildeb
        October 27, 2018

        “I have the impression control on changing gender is even tougher.”

        Impressions can be and, in this case, are wrong. In fact, self-identification of being transgendered by children has ‘enjoyed’ a 4500% increase over the past decade in England. Never mind that 66% of such children suffer from a previously diagnosed mental health illnesses or that 35% fall on the autistic spectrum. This kind of research problematic to the ideology of victimhood is censored and additional funding pulled. Medical journals that break the the taboo and publish contrary findings about transgendered issues pull the articles and apologize profusely. A sin to blasphemy, I guess.

        The Memorandum of Understanding signed by all professional healthcare bodies and endorsed by public education as well as the National Health Service in England (and coming soon to a community near you now that it has been ‘medicalized’) instruct all licensed practitioners under their purview that to even question a child’s sudden decision to identify as transgendered is Conversion Therapy, which is strictly prohibited by all these organizations on the grounds that to do so is transphobic. School administrators tell parents when they find out their children have been re-registered under a different sex – some schools in Texas have over 5% of the student population claiming to be suddenly transgendered – their hands are tied and they are not allowed to breach the child’s confidentiality and inform parents. If parents do begin exercising transphobia – that is to say, wanting to talk about this rapid onset of gender dysphoria with their children – then the schools are obligated to notify Social Services with the intent to remove the child from the ‘hostile’ home because delaying the medical procedures of hormone therapy, breast binding for girls, and surgical alterations increases the risk of depression and feelings of suicide of the self-identified student. After all, if a child raises the gender question, then the impression they are given by organizations dedicated to their ‘protection’ (aka transactivist organizations) is that they are, that they must publicly endorse the new identity or will likely suffer from increased depression and thoughts of suicide. Once the new identity is stated, there are no professional bodies that will intervene in following the medical procedures that will now be laid out for the child to undergo (in spite compelling evidence of over 80% of teens who ‘change their minds’ after initiating therapy but left to their own devices to continue to do so).

        The point here is that this is where identity politics leads, the use of State authority to implement its members own ‘righteous’ ideology over and above the actual welfare of real people, real individuals, in real life. Transactivism not only denies reality when it comes to actual genetic sex but uses homophobia to advance transgendered acceptability as if equivalently innate as the argument that same sex attraction is innate! On the one hand you say it’s not as if the Trans-movement is a single thing (I agree), but on the other…look at the acronym: LGB… and there’s the T. Oh look, it’s one victimized group! And we can’t be part of the Oppressors and Victimizers now, can we, or we we will be labelled as bigots and racists. So we’d best stand back – even if we’re professionals involved in a professional capacity where our expertise is neither wanted nor desired – and let transactivists hijack and piggyback the same sex legal advances made by gays and lesbians against obtuse and homophobic majority populations when they substitute the homophobic rapid onset gender dysphoria, which is a medical condition, donchaknow! Why do you think Iran goes along with it… but not the LGB and Q part of this group?

        I also wanted to mention a rather amusing encounter I had on a team-based World of Warships naval game where a small ship, the destroyer class (DD), announced that in this one case the ship would not undertake its usual task because it “didn’t identify” as a DD that did that sort of thing but as a battleship (BB) tasked with very different duties. That decision had profound effects on the likelihood the team could succeed in its overall mission. Other team members began chiming in about their own self-identities… from watermelons to rainbows until one team member sank the original DD (a big No No in the game) and then claimed he was the victim and had already been sunk by the now dispatched DD.. even though the ship was still there and still being sailed. The farce was an excellent example of just how ridiculous and disruptive and destructive is belief that refuses to comport with reality. It’s amusing to behold when it doesn’t cost someone something personal, but the creation of real victims is not amusing at all. It’s tragic. It’s tragic that this leader says something and actually believes something that is in reality so profoundly wrong because it’s so profoundly harmful to real people in real life.

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      • The Pink Agendist
        October 27, 2018

        If you look into those numbers carefully, what you find is that this 4500% is somewhat misleading. In actuality the increase is “Girls: 40 in the year 2009 to 1,806 in 2017 (a rise of 4,415% for girls). Boys: 57 to 713 individuals.”
        If you consider the UK has a population of over 66 million, the idea that there are 2500 young people undergoing some sort of “transition” care doesn’t seem unreasonable. I very much doubt any doctor would take the issue lightly, and the numbers seem to bear that out.

        Liked by 4 people

      • tildeb
        October 27, 2018

        As I pointed out, only transphobic doctors get in the way and they can be professionally sanctioned for practicing Conversion Therapy.

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      • The Pink Agendist
        October 27, 2018

        P.S. I don’t know much about the child thing so I’ll have to do some research before answering properly.

        Like

      • tildeb
        October 27, 2018

        And even doing research into this field can get you in professional trouble. The idea that this rapid onset gender dysphoria may actually be nothing more than a social contagion would be nice to know… but even that research by Lisa Littman (I probably spelled her name wrong) has been censored because, well, you know, she must be transphobic for actually collecting real world evidence.

        What I’m trying to point out, Pink, is that real world homophobia utilizes exactly the same method to substantiate it as real world identity politics: faith-based belief… and just as pernicious when acted upon.

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      • The Pink Agendist
        October 27, 2018

        This idea of “political correctness” as it’s presented in North America is more myth than reality. At least in a European context. Transgender people as a whole go through an extraordinary ordeal in the treatment process. And to be honest, I’ve never met anyone who took the matter lightly. Certainly not for one’s self. I’m gay and never for a second did I feel I was in the wrong body. I imagine if someone feels that, it’s a topic that merits serious attention.

        Liked by 2 people

      • tildeb
        October 27, 2018

        I agree…. but look how difficult it is to even talk about it, especially with teenagers already full of emotional turmoil and sexual insecurity. As bad as this is, it’s one tiny part of the problem.

        In addition, look at how honest research into such controversial subjects is already classified and curtailed by ideological considerations over and above any desire to find out what’s true. That no longer matters. And it is not a one-off kind of atmosphere I’m speaking about: just look at the case of Canadian sex researcher Doctor Debra Soh who saw her world renowned mentors drummed out of academia and who left the field herself entirely because the extent of ideological hostility and widespread vilification of anyone daring to reach past the ‘correct’ ideological boundaries. This fascist ideology is now massive in scale and pollutes just about every area of human endeavor – it drives the new Google search algorithms, for example – and can be found just about everywhere humans interact.

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      • john zande
        October 27, 2018

        Who’s setting these ‘correct’ ideological boundaries, and (as I’m trying to figure this out) would you say it’s good intention gone wrong?

        Liked by 2 people

      • tildeb
        October 28, 2018

        I think that’s a really good question, JZ. It’s like asking, ‘Who empowers the doctrines of the Catholic Church?” And the answer is growing ever more widespread in that those responsible are the ones not just advocating for it empowerment but also the laity, so to speak, who go along with it.

        I think social media has a huge impact on bureaucrats and administrators trying desperately to avoid becoming a contrary face to calls by many activists and even common people to implement the ideology or face public criticism they wish to avoid… in the name of supporting the ‘victim’ group whose name is used to justify the implementation of the fascist ideology. I call such people in positions of actually making these kinds of decisions “Invertebrates” because they seem to have no guiding principles to support a ethical or professional backbone other than trying to appear supportive of the downtrodden and in the face of those who claim to speak on their behalf by actively discriminating and harming real people in real life.

        This is why I call for more New Atheists to step up and start criticizing these anti-liberal obscenities when they encounter the faith-based belief that empowers them… wherever and whenever that may be. Pick any area where the ideology now is having effect and you can name the people in authority who go along with it and then rationalize why they had to collaborate with travesties of justice… in the name of justice, of course. Look at how many police officers refused to stop the child sex rings in England involving THOUSANDS of children for fear of being labeled ‘racist’ because the perpetrators had dark skin.

        And it starts right here and right now with those who go along with, say, censorship of contrary or uncomfortable ideas to the ideology yet claim they do so to support free speech, who go along with deplatforming, disinviting, rationalizing the violence of antifa in the name of respecting and supporting diversity, who think it’s okay to punch a Nazi in the name of protecting the public square from fascism, who gather to drown out speakers, who interrupt invited speakers with pulling fire alarms or physically block access to the venue in the name of fighting what they alone identify as ‘hate’ speech, who advocate privilege in law for victimized groups in the name of equality, who insist writers and editors who publish anything contrary to or critical of or questioning the ideology be fired, be confronted in restaurants and accused of being on the wrong side of history, who believe groups are real things deserving of exemptions from honest and critical contextualized comparisons, who support accusation over due process and call it giving voice to the voiceless, who frame the world as binary forces of good and evil, victims and victimizers, opporessors and the oppressed and call this faith-based belief becoming ‘woken’, who believe the dictatorship of the proletariat is necessary to implement corrective social justice over the privileged when systemic protections thwart them in the name of disempowering the empowered, of empowering the disempowered, those who tolerate universities firing professors by anonymous accusations including other staff but hiring diversity staff in the dozens or even hundreds, who think grievance studies is a legitimate academic pursuit without any need for scholarly rigor, who believe Sociology studies real entities. At its heart, PoMO ideology is enabled by anyone who believes in this GroupThink ideology and is willing to either act on its behalf or go along with its deeply anti-liberal tactics without criticism.

        Where do you want to start looking, John?

        Liked by 1 person

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 28, 2018

        What we can’t run away from is that this sort of narrative is almost identical to the anti-gay messages I heard during my childhood. In the 80’s there was Margaret Thatcher saying gay people were being (apparently wrongly) told they had the right to be gay. The idea was we were supposed to be told we not only could, but *should*, change. And that’s really what this post is about. I was sent to therapists from the age of 9/10. I had my hormone levels tested. I was told time and again in no uncertain terms that I should conform to the conventional heterosexual model. And at the time there was also “politically incorrect” research by people like Paul Cameron (who has since had his medical license revoked) that was being ignored. Research that said gays could become ex-gays. The entire result of that ordeal was pain, harm and resentment.
        So when I think of anyone telling a trans person what they feel is wrong, or that it’s just a phase, or that there’s research telling them they could be like everyone else if they just try – a chill goes up my spine. I wonder if they’ll one day feel as I do, that the outside world is a hostile environment, and that it’s better to cut themselves off.

        Liked by 5 people

      • tildeb
        October 28, 2018

        I share your sentiments. But as for medical intervention, I think the baseline necessary to be capable of making a responsible decision is informed consent with the emphasis on informed. To be informed means having the information – as much information as one can gain – available. When I see this pursuit of gaining information to be intentionally impeded on ideological grounds, I expect criticism and push back from rational and reasonable people and this is what I find is generally missing. That’s the alarm I’m raising.

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      • The Pink Agendist
        October 28, 2018

        I’ve looked up the protocol, which says this:
        “The transition-affirming protocol tells parents to treat their children as the gender they desire, and to place them on puberty blockers around age 11 or 12 if they are gender dysphoric.

        If by age 16, the children still insist that they are trapped in the wrong body, they are placed on cross-sex hormones, and biological girls may obtain a double mastectomy.

        So-called “bottom surgeries,” or genital reassignment surgeries, are not recommended before age 18, though some surgeons have recently argued against this restriction.”

        The only point there I find a bit borderline is a double mastectomy at 16, which seems early in my mind – but then again, I’m a lay person, and I’m not trans so I don’t grasp the intensity of their feelings. Do you find the protocol objectionable?

        Liked by 1 person

      • tildeb
        October 28, 2018

        I do when the diagnosis is made based on rapid onset gender dysphoria, for which there is very concerning but suppressed evidence that this is a social contagion and not a medical condition. We wouldn’t do any other medical intervention based on the sudden feelings of an 11 year old and we certainly wouldn’t cut parent who are held legally responsible for the child out of the equation and then remove the child if the parents demonstrated that responsibility.

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      • The Pink Agendist
        October 28, 2018

        Do you genuinely believe there’s any child out there who thinks changing gender is going to be like a trip to Disneyland? You don’t think all of them are actually scared to death of rejection from family and friends? Terrified of social marginalization?

        Liked by 1 person

      • tildeb
        October 28, 2018

        Not when over 5% of a Texas public middle school’s population ‘suddenly’ develop this ‘medical’ condition.

        Like

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 28, 2018

        Where does that number come from?

        Like

      • tildeb
        October 28, 2018

        This one example comes from a parent/councilor I’ve followed for quite some time commenting on a Quillette article by Debra Soh about homophobia in parental responses to rapid onset gender dysphoria in young and preteens:

        “The most important point that is glossed over is the medical harm done to these kids. In the US, there is no oversight. Kids are quickly put on puberty blockers or cross-sex hormones. Testosterone is offered as young as 12 years old. Over 5% of my daughter’s entire school identified as transgender. One student who had a mastectomy at age 16. They took hormones with the same casual attitude that they took their antidepressants and anti-anxiety meds. Here is an example of what is happening on our “elite” college campuses: https://4thwavenow.com/2018/10/02/theres-a-sudden-surge-of-trans-students-coming-out-at-my-college-and-im-scared-to-talk-about-it/#comments

        The public does not know how prevalent and how quickly kids are medicalized. If they did, I think we might see some outrage. The medical harms are serious and irreversible. Paglia is correct. This is child abuse masquerading as life-saving affirmative care. What happened to “First Do No Harm”?

        Second point: from my observations of high schools and colleges, and conversations with scores of parents whose kids are caught up in this, many of the older kids are not same-sex attracted, but are simply young people who are vulnerable and trying to fit in. For some reason, identifying as trans provides them an identity, gives them status, protects them from the vulnerabilities of being a woman, etc. I don’t think it is accurate to describe most of these trans-identifying kids as gay. Perhaps this generalization applies to the younger kids, like Jazz Jennings, but not as much to the older ones. Rather, I would describe them as vulnerable and confused. Interestingly, all that I have observed are intellectually gifted.”

        Like

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 28, 2018

        Sorry, but that’s so far off the deep end, it’s insulting. Particularly insulting because I’ve heard it all before referring to gay people. Back then any celebrity coming out was a danger because it would “encourage” children to “want to become gay”. Being transgender is one of the most difficult situations anyone could possibly experience. When you’re gay or lesbian you can blend in, some of the time. Trans people are a target 24/7. Have you ever seen a trans person in a supermarket? Walking down the street? The people staring, the comments? I know what the pressure to conform was for a gay boy. The horror I and many others had to go through. You can’t possibly, with a straight face be saying you think stepping into the opposite gender is some sort of breezy experience? Seriously, that’s insulting.

        Liked by 1 person

      • tildeb
        October 28, 2018

        I have nothing but empathy for anyone suffering from sexual dysphoria. Why indeed would anyone put themselves through this ordeal if they could choose otherwise?

        \But I have great skepticism, however, that gender dysphoria is equivalent. I want more scientific information before public policies are implemented around gender issues that neuter and make illegal any parent’s rights to be responsible for their children’s welfare, that demands any questioning is phobic, that any research is verboten unless it aligns.

        I think there’s a conflation going on here and being badly abused when transgendered activists pretend to speak as if they do so – as you have done here – on behalf of data about transexuals while, at the same time, pursuing policies that I think very much harm real people in real life and the rest of us just go along.

        Like

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 28, 2018

        I’m not sure how well you’re setting standards of evidence. Is the implication mainstream doctors and therapists have developed the wrong protocol while a very small minority have the correct protocol?
        That’s the position of the religious group known as The Family Research Council regarding all research on homosexuality. The problem is the evidence to back up that position is just not there. When I asked you for the 5% reference you sent me to a wordpress blog comment. Not quite a respectable and verifiable standard.

        Liked by 1 person

      • tildeb
        October 28, 2018

        I agree. I would love nothing better than to have good research to turn to… if only good research were available rather than taking only the anecdotal word of school councillors, sex ed authors, affected parents, renowned sex researchers de-platformed and dis-invited and fired and kept from publishing their data… to the righteous glee of people like Gr8Grandmother and VioletWhisp who will tolerate no dissent from whatever they’re told to believe by transactivists.

        Like

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 28, 2018

        See, this is what I mean about your standards of evidence not being reasonable or rational.
        The protocol was arrived at based on the best available evidence. You’re telling us we should disregard that and take fringe anecdotal evidence as being more reasonable? Because someone is saying they feel persecuted? I’ve actually taken the time to have a look at some of these sites that have similar information to what you say. Mainly this one: https://www.dailysignal.com/2017/07/03/im-pediatrician-transgender-ideology-infiltrated-field-produced-large-scale-child-abuse/
        I’d love for you to visit it as a sceptic and tell me what you think is wrong with the narrative. What’s not adding up in her arguments?

        Liked by 1 person

      • tildeb
        October 29, 2018

        My original point was to suggest that comparably higher rates of transsexual people in Brazil could be linked to homophobia that is so openly blatant in this Trump wannabe in your post. I wondered if the same homophobia might be at play elsewhere, made manifest in some authoritarian states like Iran, where the incorrect assumption based on theology is used to justify transition to the opposite sex rather than simply accept innate same sex attraction. God doesn’t approve, as so many people seem to think, so it cannot possibly be same sex attraction might be perfectly natural. I thought this was interesting and that you would have opportunity to identify the personal cost in living as a gay man under that what I think is a fairly widespread unstated homophobic assumption in the West. I also thought it was interesting – and dangerous – that perhaps parents might be more accepting of transitioning children who question their sexuality rather than having to accept same sex attraction in their offspring. Again, an unstated homophobia that expresses itself in this way and so might be an interesting idea to consider, I thought, and one perhaps not many people might have encountered to provide a “Hmm, that’s an interesting idea….” comment.

        But, of course, my inability to express this clearly plays a part in what inevitably becomes a hostile series of response commentary as if I am advocating some kind of discriminatory response when I’m not. If you go back over the comments I’ve made, you’ll see that my concern is about belief being used rather than good evidence that when acted upon harms real people in real life. I think sudden onset gender dysphoria is exactly the kind of ‘medical’ condition that is built from belief that may be wrong in fact and yet is swelling the ranks of children undergoing the transitional process. Rather than explore this possibility, you want to somehow make it seem that for me to raise the issue itself is a form of bigotry on my part, that I’m not providing you with appropriately vetted evidence. I’ve pointed out that just trying to obtain this evidence by professional researchers is faced with the same false charge and to effect of stopping sex researchers from being able to collect this data. Rather than find this adverse condition worthy of criticism, you twist it to mean that I am presenting an argument not appropriately supported when, in fact and in reality, it is.

        Okay, fine. I’m the bad guy for raising the issue of how homophobia can continue under the guise of anti-bigoted gender identity through medicalizing transitioning children who simply question – as is typical for most children – their sexual preferences during development. And I’m the bad guy for pointing out how this transactivism dedicated to stopping any research done that produces contrary findings to the identity gender movement is harming real people in real life. Harming children, in this case. You’re good with that, obviously, because criticizing the ideology behind it cannot possibly be linked to anyone but bigots. Ergo, raising the issue of not having enough good data is itself homophobic bigotry, apparently, so let’s all wring our hands and blame everyone else for our own blatant blindness, foolishness, and dedication to a harmful ideology aimed at children. Yes, it is the sex researchers like Debra Soh who are the real problem because we can quibble about the exact percentage of a 4000% + increase in transitioning children in England that results from diagnosing rapid onset gender dysphoria as the same as sexual dysphoria. Questioning this diagnosis – and the reasons for it – on medical grounds is itself bigotry. Yeah, I get it. I just don;t agree with it, which makes me a bigot according to many. I’m just sorry so many people go along with it out of fear of being similarly smeared.

        In a truly perverted way, I think you’re doing your part to shield this hidden homophobia that I think hides behind so much adult acceptance of transitioning the sex of children – especially girls – and I think you should think long and hard about it. You see, I’m really not the problem. Harmed children is the result of the problem and and I think that’s a problem worth investigating and, hopefully, correcting. As long as people like I am – who raise the concern about medicalizing what could be a social contagion – are considered the problem, the practice advocated by transactivists will continue to harm real children in real life in ever growing numbers. The ideology that promotes this is the problem.

        Like

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 29, 2018

        Remember Katy Faust (Askthebigot)? The anti-gay religious nut? Have a look at what she’s been up to lately: http://www.slowlyboiledfrog.com/2018/10/katy-fausts-transgender-treatment-plan.html

        Liked by 1 person

      • john zande
        October 29, 2018

        Gotta’ factor in the “macho” culture, which really plays a big part. Lot of Latin chest thumping, mostly all for show.

        Liked by 2 people

      • violetwisp
        October 29, 2018

        @tildeb You are the bad guy. You’re part of yet another echo-chamber group-think that is sure they’ve discovered the Most Important Group to Hate in the World, and takes every conversational opportunity to drag their Hated Group into any discussion to prove they are the Problem. Look at yourself. This is about Brazil electing a leader who has made public statements nothing short of hate speech about gay people. And you’ve entered with another 1000 page onslaught about a largely fictious political group you think is destroying society. My goodness, there are so many other things to worry about, but you’re obsessed with a sub-group of a tiny minority group who suffer immense persecution at every turn. You really have to ask what you’ve become.

        Being openly trans in western society a new phenomenon we have to explore and let develop. There may be bumps along the way, but it’s currently about allowing people to explore what identity is to them, and how they express that comfortably in their surroundings. If you realise the piercing hatred that screams through in your rants. There’s no sense from you of being part of a healing process that helps trans people reach satisfying conclusions for themselves – there’s preaching, there’s condemnation and there’s outright lies that get pumped round your echo-chamber. It’s exactly like the WhatsApp groups that have brought Bolsonaro to power. The more of Arb-&-buddies rants you read, the more your bias is confirmed.

        Liked by 2 people

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 29, 2018

        Katy Faust took down her anti-trans video, did you see it? SBF wrote about it.

        Like

      • violetwisp
        October 29, 2018

        Had a quick look. She’s swimming in obscurity where she belongs, we should leave her there.

        Liked by 3 people

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 29, 2018

        P.S. Every other day a trans person is brutally attacked or murdered in Brazil. By brutally I mean beheadings, stonings, beatings.
        They’re trans in a country where trans people get zero assistance. No hormone therapy, no puberty blockers, and they’re still trans.

        Liked by 2 people

      • violetwisp
        October 29, 2018

        Kind of ruins Tildeb’s little theory. Maybe he believes they’re being brainwashed by Iran via the internet.

        Liked by 2 people

      • inspiredbythedivine1
        October 29, 2018

        Not Iran. The Swiss. Those bastards have infiltrated ALL our minds via the internet. Actually, we’re all writing and speaking in Swiss. We’re just not aware of it. I need to pay a visit to Ms Faust. Fucking with her is fun.

        Liked by 2 people

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 29, 2018

        They even tried to infiltrate Kashoggi’s mind, but no one knows where it is…

        Liked by 1 person

      • inspiredbythedivine1
        October 29, 2018

        Fertilizing a rose bush by now, I’m sure.

        Liked by 1 person

      • violetwisp
        October 29, 2018

        No, no, no, that’s how Bolsonaro got into power. Don’t raise the profile of the harmful by interacting them for fun. Let them burn out in peace.

        Liked by 1 person

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 29, 2018

        You’d be surprised how much air time those anti-trans ideas are getting. It’s coming from the same crowd that’s anti-Muslim. A combination of the Christian right and the alt-right, and some just going along for the ride.

        Like

      • violetwisp
        October 29, 2018

        Change is frightening. Even if that change is just openly acknowledging and respecting states of being that have existed in humans forever. I’m similar to Tildeb that I don’t like the idea of operations and irreversible treatments, and anywhere someone is making a profit I’m suspicious. But I’m not trans, and I therefore don’t understand on any level what individual trans people require to cope with their circumstances. I’d like to think that if society becomes less gender focussed and less discriminatory that fewer trans people would feel the need to choose that. We’re not there yet and I’m not psychic. Neither is he.

        Liked by 3 people

      • violetwisp
        October 29, 2018

        Has he been doing this non-stop since I’ve been away? He seems worse. And you seem calmer.

        Liked by 1 person

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 29, 2018

        I’m on Baclofen to not drink and stay calm. Almost 6 months now.

        Liked by 1 person

      • tildeb
        October 29, 2018

        Believe or not, VW, I know your heart is the right place; it’s your mind operating by faith-based belief that I think requires a bit of review.

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      • The Pink Agendist
        October 29, 2018

        If you accept anecdotal evidence as fact and dismiss mainstream evidence as somehow manipulated, don’t you think that perhaps there’s a degree of bias influencing your perception? Putting your “faith” on the side where there’s the least verifiable evidence doesn’t seem like the most rational path.

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      • tildeb
        October 30, 2018

        What on earth are you talking about, Pink? I have very compelling evidence from sex researchers, child councilors, public health officials, teachers, psychologists, all indicating a very concerning problem regarding the medicalization and the direction of public health policies regarding rapid onset gender dysphoria. The message is unequivocal: something is wrong. The only ‘anecdotal’ evidence I’ve used is from people actually involved in seeing these real world concerns in action, seeing real harm done to real children in real life, and the institutionalized and policy impediments by oversight organizations and departments of health from investigating the ‘condition’ any further. Why aren’t you concerned?

        Like

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 30, 2018

        Sorry, but you don’t. In fact when you used the 4500% number without telling us how that broke down in a population of 66 million, you gave a misleading impression. That’s outright deception.
        Sending me a blog comment as evidence of the 5% number you were alleging in Texas was also entirely irresponsible.
        I decided to do a bit of research because on the face of it, your theory was indeed disturbing, but I found absolutely nothing, and I mean zero to support the idea there’s anything happening outside of medical “good practices”.
        When I add that to your history of repeating other questionable anti trans information – I can only conclude your bias is still present. You’ve given me verifiably false evidence on alleged trans attacks, rapes – and even false evidence saying women were afraid they might have to share sleeper carriages with trans people when there haven’t been female only sleeper carriages in most of the world since before I was born in the 70’s.
        And as if that weren’t enough you try on the “if you disagree with me you don’t care about children” line which isn’t just manipulative, it’s hogwash. It’s straight out of the Christian Right playbook:

        Liked by 2 people

      • tildeb
        October 30, 2018

        Dr Soh.

        Like

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 30, 2018

        Yes, that’s what I’m talking about. Dr. Soh is repeating what I spent my youth hearing. That children who didn’t conform to the heterosexual model should not be affirmed. It’s offensive. And it’s a minority opinion.
        There are also doctors still promoting gay conversion therapy, because they believe gay people should change. That doesn’t mean they’re right. Evidence is not on their side.

        Liked by 1 person

      • tildeb
        October 30, 2018
      • The Pink Agendist
        October 30, 2018

        All that means is that doctors have to be extra careful in the guiding process. The protocol as outlined, is in fact, just that. Incredibly careful. There’s no suggestion it’s a three month process with no safeguards *anywhere*.

        Liked by 1 person

      • Curious Mother
        October 30, 2018

        Ummm. Hi Tildeb *waves nervously*. So . . . I’m the parent of a transgender child. Not one of those “rapid onset” ones though – he transitioned at nine although we’d all talked about it for nearly two years prior to that. If that matters at all.

        First of all, I want to acknowledge that a frightening, homophobic man has just been elected to power in Brazil and that a trans woman and a drag queen have been killed in two separate incidents in the last two weeks by attackers invoking Bolsonaro’s name: https://www.nbcnews.com/feature/nbc-out/lgbtq-brazilians-edge-after-self-described-homophobic-lawmaker-elected-president-n925726.

        I also want to acknowledge Pink’s story again, of internalising the belief that those that loved him would prefer him dead than gay.

        I could give you facts and alternative studies but we might end up in an endless loop of arguments and counter-arguments and I get too tired.

        The vexed predicament of transgender kids is treated differently in different countries. I know that in England, waiting times for consultation at the NHS can stretch to 18 months: https://metro.co.uk/2018/10/28/itvs-butterfly-has-come-at-a-crucial-time-but-it-doesnt-represent-my-reality-of-having-a-trans-child-8073207/.

        In Australia (where I am) we’re starting to get some reasonable standards of practice but I can assure you that any intervention is very slow, multifaceted and careful: https://www.rch.org.au/uploadedFiles/Main/Content/adolescent-medicine/australian-standards-of-care-and-treatment-guidelines-for-trans-and-gender-diverse-children-and-adolescents.pdf

        I think you’re in the US and I certainly hear of lots of different stories from there, given the diverse policies and practices across different States. This is part of the problem, of course, in finding a general story about trans kids or about how they are being treated.

        I’m just going to end with a few notes about the Littman study and about Debra Soh, as I’ve followed both writers for a while.

        Firstly, Littman has NOT been silenced or her work suppressed. LOOK, HERE IT IS – READ IT IF YOU WANT: https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0202330. It’s on PLoS One, which is open source, and anyone can access Littman’s work, any time.

        The controversy (as far as I know) revolves around the fact that Littman’s employer, Brown University, was openly endorsing the research and then reneged the endorsement because of questions about the rigour of the research. Basically, Rapid Onset Gender Dysphoria was a term coined only about two and a half years ago, by a group of concerned parents who had coalesced around two blogs 4thWaveNow and TransgenderTrend. They are transphobic or gender skeptical, depending on how you look at it. What these groups are not is neutral; thus, the majority of Littman’s data comes from a group of parents who were already convinced that their child’s gender identity was not real and was rather part of a social contagion, fuelled largely by the internet. These parents may or may not be right – but Littman’s paper was thus not an academic inquiry, it was a paper that argued for a pre-existing bias.

        As for Debra Soh. Soh first published an article in the Pacific Standard in 2015, when she was still a PhD student. Here is is: https://psmag.com/social-justice/why-transgender-kids-should-wait-to-transition. At the time, Soh was a PhD student researching neuroscience and sex and was interested in ‘furries’. As you can see if you read the article, she never conducted any primary research. It was an opinion piece. This is partly why her opponents got upset, including me. There’s an analysis here: https://theconversation.com/why-rapid-onset-gender-dysphoria-is-bad-science-92742

        From my point of view, there are two groups that need to be invested in answering questions about the best line of treatment and support for transgender children and their families. One is the transgender children themselves, and their loved ones. The other group is the treating professionals. I think it’s very difficult to form a useful or accurate perspective if you are removed from all of this. I’m also never quite sure why those that aren’t involved choose to involve themselves anyway. I also know that if you’re one of the people that has decided that there’s a sudden wave of kids who are being transitioned either too hastily or against their will I’m unlikely to convince you otherwise. For the record anyway, this opinion is wrong and has no basis in fact.

        To conclude, it is a terrible time for LGBTIQ Brazilians. I wish them lives free from fear and filled with acceptance and love.

        Liked by 4 people

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 30, 2018

        Sorry that took a second to be published. When there’s more than one link wordpress automatically puts the comment in the spam folder. All cleared now 🙂

        Liked by 1 person

      • Curious Mother
        October 30, 2018

        I like WordPress but I don’t like the inability to edit comments and the trickiness of posting links 🙂

        Liked by 1 person

      • tildeb
        October 30, 2018

        As is usually the case, I don’t think we’re very far at all from sharing the same concerns. Were we begin to diverge is this concern I have about the very disturbing intrusion into academia that does the research into such areas by an ideologically motivated camp. One would have to be deaf, blind, and dumb not to see this ideological intrusion sweeping academia to highly detrimental effect in everything it touches to the point where research becomes ‘shoddy’ (it’s always a central issue in all scientifically presented research) whenever and wherever and in whatever field of study it comes into conflict with the intrusive ideology.

        Sex research has been highly targeted. Many have left the field entirely and, having spoken at length with professors whose areas touch on the research, I know that very few graduate students are willing to go into the area at all, so toxic has become the field to any honest ‘scientific’ inquiry. It has become and ideological battleground that science has already lost.

        Are we served by this? Are people with sex dysphoria served by this?

        What little remains of the field in various institutions is almost always perfectly aligned with the ideology involving socially correct gender studies (fast becoming correctly identified as ‘grievance’ studies). We see this confusion between ‘gender’ studies and ‘sex’ studies all the time with the crossover used incessantly by those who wish to replace biological sex as the ‘chosen’ feature with ‘gender’ as the innate condition. This is an inversion of reality, by replacing the norm with the outliers and then tolerating only the ‘science’ that aligns.

        Now notice the trend: any sex researcher who produces any sex-based research contrary to this ideologically acceptable gender framework 1) does shoddy research, and 2) is of dubious character. Notice the response: universities begin to receive widespread condemnation for 1) facilitating bigotry, 2) employing bigots, and 3) will have their donors targeted.

        Most universities put up a bit of a fight but almost all have surrendered. It’s not worth the sullying of their reputation.

        This is not some trivial or rare side issue, nor is it an issue that can be shuffled to the side because it interferes with helping children with sexual dysphoria. Throw in body dysphoria, conflate gender dysphoria with sex dysphoria, and I don’t need to tell you about the confusing effects throughout the medical community for people seeking real medical assistance for any of these conditions. But someone has to start raising the alarm when we already have compelling evidence that about 80% of those pre-teen and teens who fall under the rapid onset gender dysphora diagnosis will reverse their decisions if given that opportunity by their later teen years and early 20s. How many conversion and then deconversion stories as compelling as your own long and torturous road to help your child are equivalently available to those who seek to help those with gender confusion today? My central point is that I do not think people like you are well served to have to rely on ideologically framed information substituting for open and honest scientifically gathered information. That ship has already sailed but I think we need to reverse its course.

        Like

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 30, 2018

        Read your comment back to yourself. Do you have any idea of how absurd it sounds?
        For what you’re saying to be true we’d have to believe there’s some sort of cabal of trans-activists so powerful they’re capable of controlling academia worldwide. Never mind that each country has different medical associations, practices and legislation in the sex/reproduction areas.
        Where have I seen your argument before? Oh, here:
        ” June 6, 2012 (LifeSiteNews.com) – A former president of the American Psychological Association (APA), who also introduced the motion to declassify homosexuality as a mental illness in 1975, says that the APA has been taken over by “ultraliberals” beholden to the “gay rights movement,” who refuse to allow an open debate on reparative therapy for homosexuality.

        https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/former-president-of-apa-says-organization-controlled-by-gay-rights-movement

        Liked by 2 people

      • tildeb
        October 30, 2018

        Oh, I see. It’s normal business for an award winning editor highly regarded to get fired for publishing rather than spiking the Gomeshi essay. It’s normal business for professors to get fired for wearing Halloween costumes. It’s normal business for fiction authors to have their work reviewed by cultural appropriation diversity agents and even trashed if it crosses the subjective ‘offense’ barrier. It’s normal for renowned teachers to get fired for accusations alone. It’s normal business to suspend an entire sports team for an empty accusation. It’s normal business for medical people and administrators to tell concerned parents that their child’s gender has changed and so the institutionalized response to it is ‘out of their hands’. It’s normal business to have student councils determine university policies. And so on and so on, and so on… Why, it’s normal to fire employees who write internal memos accurately depicting the scientific consensus about the very real problems of equity hiring he is expected to fulfill, normal to go after scientists who produce solid research because it supports claims you might not like about intelligence, normal to shut down research that is problematic to a university’s image when the data begins to show disparity with the current social ‘norms’, normal to ban certain web hosts on YouTube for being too offensive in views deemed ‘alt-right’ (but never, ever too ‘ctrl-Left’), normal to demand public apologies from those who speak truthfully and have compelling evidence to back it up or lose their entire careers, and so on, and so on, and so on.

        Yes, yes, yes… bigots and racists they all must be. Nothing but rainbows and puppy dogs for those who carry out these injustices in the name of justice and intolerance in the name of tolerance and demand for equity of results in the name of diversity. Yup, no problem here at all. It’s The Truth (TM) after all.

        The ideology is very real, widespread, and very active especially on university campuses throughout the West and a very real problem in media. And it is forwarded into being every time another person goes along with the narrative and then implements its acceptable conditions to appear woken while staying silent and collaborating with this ideological destruction of Western enlightenment values in action.

        Like

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 30, 2018

        You’re evidently much more far gone than I imagined. When you get all your information from the same bubble, perception is skewed.
        A rational person would take into account that the Ian Buruma firing is one case. How many are there on the other side? How many editors have kept their jobs after publishing stories that justified or excused sexual assault? Do more people keep or lose their jobs in those instances? For how many decades have Woody Allen and Roman Polanski been defended by large swathes of the press?
        I’m willing to bet the vast majority of similar cases are never challenged. And the ones who are will always have the right wing press ready to embrace them. Has Bill O’Reilly not found a new home yet?
        The point I’m making is valid for every single event you mention. They’re not the rule, they’re exceptions. Even the ones you’re repeating without evidence (by again insinuating there’s some sort of movement to force children into being transgender.)
        As I’ve said before you’ve adopted the David Irving method of evidence analysis. As Cannadine put it, Irving’s “double standard on evidence” demanded absolute documentary proof to convict the Germans (as when he sought to show that Hitler was not responsible for the Holocaust), while relying on circumstantial evidence to condemn the British (as in his account of the Allied bombing of Dresden) – you use this same method to condemn the mainstream position on transgender children while fully embracing a minority position based on questionable evidence formulated by interested parties.
        Your position is academically unsound. It’s on the doorstep of conspiracy theorist territory. And there’s nothing related to Western Enlightenment in that.

        Like

      • Curious Mother
        October 30, 2018

        TildeB, I don’t think we agree on that much. If you are as worried about ideology infiltrating universities and Group Think as much as you say, can I request you devote yourself to examples other than children supposedly getting ‘transed’ and institutions saying it’s ‘out of their hands’. The children and parents you express concern for certainly don’t need your help.

        I’m off to work on ‘Western enlightenment values in action’ (as an academic at a university) but found a piece that I wrote about three years ago about Debra Soh. I originally called it ‘Integrity’ because I didn’t think Soh had much. I’ve republished it on my new blog this morning – just for you! (but take down the link if you like, Pink – I’m not spruiking for readership and I’ll bow out of this conversation now): https://raisingorlandoblog.wordpress.com/2018/10/30/throwback-wednesday-a-response-to-debra-soh/

        Liked by 2 people

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 30, 2018

        I didn’t know you were back up. Fantastic! You can link anytime you like. We’re all stronger working together.

        Liked by 2 people

      • violetwisp
        October 30, 2018

        I know your heart is in the right place too. It’s your selective-fact-based echo chamber lifestyle that needs aired. And a bit of self reflection about the nature of predictable conservatism in 80s/90s aging ‘liberals’. At some point each generation starts to resist progress/new concepts/evolution in society and reacts with fear to phenomena that weren’t accepted when they were trendy and young.

        Liked by 2 people

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 30, 2018

        When people promote misinformation that incites hatred I’m not sure their heart is in a good place.
        Promoting Bannon’s discourse as Tildeb has just been doing on his blog is very dubious territory.

        Liked by 3 people

      • Clare Flourish
        December 19, 2018

        I wanted to comment to express solidarity, though I suspect Mr Bolsonaro would like me as a relative even less than you. I am so sad that you have had to answer points about trans issues on a post which is so personal and so beautifully apropos. Thank you for your straight bat (!) There are times to debate “rapid onset” gender dysphoria (better called “Suddenly disclosed” gender dysphoria) and times simply to express solidarity.

        Liked by 1 person

  13. acflory
    October 27, 2018

    The world has changed, Pinky. Maybe not in Brazil, but in country after country, people are acknowledging that we are all just people. Who we love and how we love is simply one small part of who we are, like having red hair or brown.

    And whoever you were in the dark days is not who you are now. You can’t change into the person you might have been at five. You can’t undo all the hurt, but you can say ‘fuck it, I /like/ who I am now and no one else matters’.

    Believe it or not, learning to love yourself is one of the nice things about getting older. 🙂

    -hugs-

    Liked by 5 people

    • The Pink Agendist
      October 27, 2018

      Have you read Ariel Leve? There’s a great interview with her here: https://www.theguardian.com/books/2016/jul/02/ariel-leve-i-had-to-write-this-book-in-order-to-be-free

      As she explains, there are changes that go on in the brain when a child feels like they have no one they can count on. “Stress hormones flood and engorge the amygdala.” In a sense that mechanism never goes away. One is always on alert because you have a profound sense there’ll never be anyone out there to catch you.

      Liked by 3 people

      • acflory
        October 28, 2018

        I don’t think I’ll ever read that book. Just reading the interview was unpleasant. I can’t imagine living that life. I had a strained relationship with my mother, but still within the bounds of ‘normal’. :/

        The amygdala teaches us to be afraid. It has to be powerful because early homo sapiens rarely got to survive, and hence learn from, the same experience twice. These days it can cause more harm than good.

        I have no evidence of this, but I believe that OCD is the result of the amygdala going haywire.

        I don’t know how you reset the amygdala, Pinky. I think it can be done, perhaps using similar methods to those used against phobias.

        Can I ask…the people from your childhood, the ones who still survive, do they have any idea of what they did to you? Have /they/ changed at all, in their attitudes towards you? Perhaps that is something you need to find out. -hugs-

        Liked by 1 person

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 28, 2018

        The people from my childhood weren’t interested then, there would be no reason for them to be interested now. And to be honest I simply wouldn’t believe anything they might have to say at this point.

        I’ve tried all sorts of therapies. In the end the only formula that makes me feel relatively at ease is being home, with the dogs and Mike.
        It’s a bubble where I feel safe because I have full control over everything. Electric gates with camera and intercom, caller id, the lot. Also, everything is beautiful and the food is pretty good 🙂

        Like

      • acflory
        October 29, 2018

        Ah…control. Yes, I understand. I fought with my Mum pretty much my entire life. We did not get on because she refused to admit any reality that didn’t fit her self-image. Drove me crazy. But right at the end I stopped fighting her and promised I’d look after her. We all thought she’d recover. She died the next morning. I discovered that I missed her and that some of the good things in my life, I owed to her. My sudden sense of release wasn’t because she died though, it was because I wouldn’t have to live with guilt forever more.

        Your case is very different. I know that. But I hope that you find the same sense of release one day. That feeling that they have no power over you any more because you have become the strong one. -huge hugs-

        Liked by 1 person

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 29, 2018

        I’m there most of the time. For 80 or 90% of the day everything is fine. Then there’s that little bit of extremely unpleasant invasive bad memories. If they stopped trying to contact me completely, it would be a tremendous help. TREMENDOUS. Especially because there’s not a chance in hell I’d ever engage in any sort of relationship with them again. I’d rather die.

        Like

      • acflory
        October 29, 2018

        I’m so sorry, Pinky. If it’s any consolation, you have a bunch of people here who think you’re okay. 🙂

        Liked by 1 person

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 29, 2018

        It’s massive consolation!

        Like

      • acflory
        October 29, 2018

        Awww….you can be a Sweet Agendist at times, you know that? -hugs-

        Liked by 1 person

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 29, 2018

        Take that back, immediately! 😛

        Like

      • acflory
        October 29, 2018

        Sorry, SORRY! It was a…typo. I meant to type TWEET agendist….

        Liked by 1 person

  14. davidprosser
    October 27, 2018

    Why is it big people have little people but don’t like it when the little people have their own personalities. Surely that’s why you have them, not to create.yourself or Hitler in miniature but someone who will go on giving you surprises for years. If you’re gay you should be allowed to live with it while the big people should be big enough to accept it as their child’s nature.
    Hugs

    Liked by 3 people

    • The Pink Agendist
      October 27, 2018

      I’m afraid people’s motives aren’t always the best or most mature when they decide to have children.

      Liked by 2 people

  15. foolsmusings
    October 27, 2018

    I really feel we are at the beginning of a breakdown in society and the beginning of a devastating world conflict. The lines in the sand are being drawn and it’s a long time since they’ve represented such ugliness. 😦

    Liked by 2 people

    • The Pink Agendist
      October 27, 2018

      It’s very frightening to watch. Particularly how the breakdown is panning out under this “religious liberty” narrative. The denial of birth control coverage, the denial of service to gays. I think we’re in fairly safe countries, but I fear for people where religious groups hold a lot of power.

      Liked by 3 people

  16. Anony Mole
    October 27, 2018

    Strong showing here. You’ve struck a chord.

    One positive notion is that, in general, the world is getting better, across all aspects, including this one. Yes, in pockets (recently) populism, the ultra-right and religiously delusional have exposed their foul underbellies. But, on average, the world is getting more tolerant and less oppressive.

    It is sad to note though, that even if a dominant alien race were to descend and threaten humanity there would still be those who would side with the aliens rather than their fellow humans of alternative beliefs and lifestyles.

    Liked by 3 people

    • The Pink Agendist
      October 27, 2018

      You’re right. What I see today is light years away from my childhood. Thank goodness, because it’s not easy being permanently cast as the villain. In fact, it’s exhausting.

      Liked by 2 people

      • Anony Mole
        October 27, 2018

        I thought we agreed you’d make a great Machiavelli Emperor?

        Liked by 2 people

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 27, 2018

        We did! And I would! But what will be my Empire?

        Liked by 2 people

      • Anony Mole
        October 27, 2018

        I vote you rule over all the even-tempered, tolerant and charitable humans — you know, us.

        Liked by 1 person

      • Esme upon the Cloud
        October 31, 2018

        ‘We did! And I would! But what will be my Empire?’ – Shrews and bees. We’ll see how you do with them before unleashing you on the rest of us, hahahaha.

        – Esme Cloud

        Liked by 1 person

  17. john zande
    October 27, 2018

    Last polls just released before voting:

    Bolsonaro 54%, Haddad 46%

    Liked by 1 person

  18. Curious Mother
    October 28, 2018

    You write beautifully. I often think of the phrase Jeanette Winterson used for the title of her autobiography, “Why be happy when you could be normal?” It seemed a crazy sentiment when I first came across it but I hear it paraphrased just about every day in relation to my trans son 😦

    Liked by 2 people

    • The Pink Agendist
      October 28, 2018

      Thank you 🙂
      Not sure if you noticed but Tildeb has a lot of questions about the development of trans youngsters he’s asking here which I don’t quite know how to answer. As a parent have you ever felt any pressure to take any particular course?

      Liked by 1 person

      • Curious Mother
        October 30, 2018

        Sigh. I noticed. Yes, every day of my life. No hyperbole. I’ve stayed away from blogging & Twitter for over a year now. It’s nice to read your stuff again – less fun to think about ROGD and the GRA and Debra Soh. I’ll have a think & try to respond to Tildeb. Nicely. Maybe even with wit. You’ve taught me that 😉

        Liked by 2 people

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 30, 2018

        I know it’s excruciating, often exhausting. Especially so for a parent as your protective instinct probably makes feelings rise up to the surface in a more intense way… but as Mike used to tell me a long time ago when I’d say, “why do we have to accept dinner invitations from homophobic people? I want to stay home!” – and he’d look at me and say, “We have to stake our claim to our place in the world.”
        I’ve spent the past couple of days looking at the state of the current debates, and what surprises me most (or perhaps not) is to see there’s nothing new under the sun. Dr. Soh has jumped on the Jordan Peterson, I’m being persecuted woe is me, bandwagon. A surefire way to guarantee airtime on conservative and religious platforms these days. In fact, not just these days:

        Liked by 2 people

      • Curious Mother
        October 30, 2018

        Ah yes, Jordan Peterson. I have spent WAY too much time following the words of that man, especially this year, since he visited Australia.

        I think it’s taken me a while to realise the many, many nefarious ways in which fascism can be dressed up: I mean, I felt SORRY for Peterson when he talked about his depression. You can be a deranged lunatic and still not be all bad. As for Soh, I wrote about her when her first article about trans kids came out. It was puzzling . . . she was a 25 year old PhD student with no apparent research into the subject (I still don’t think she’s done any primary research on transgender identities). I think she’s basically just trying to earn a living and has found an angle which earns her lots of clicks.

        Thanks for the note of sympathy. Yes, it’s exhausting. You’re right though- or Mike’s right – about staking claims. The thing is – I usually regret speaking up about trans things. Firstly, I’m not trans but it also doesn’t help my family or my son (or really anyone else) in any obvious way – and I get stressed out and sad.

        How long can I – or anyone else – just live out their lives quietly though? At what point are you obliged to speak truth to power? *scuttles off to Tilbeb’s posts again*.

        Thank you again for your sad and lovely meditation on the wrongness of things.

        Liked by 1 person

  19. Men Who Brunch
    October 28, 2018

    Pathetic. Ironically enough alot of homophobic men secretly indulge in relationships with other men.

    Liked by 1 person

  20. I hope to HELL to deplatform tildeb.
    What a complete asshole. I hope he is refused service everywhere he goes. Ban him to the dark corners of the universe. Shout him down!

    I have been casually following the Brazil news and it is revolting. I am a smouldering cauldron of RAGE thinking of the Brazilian citizens who are lesbian, gay, bi-sexual and transgender. I mean it really ENRAGES me. I HATE the hate, it makes me want to puke, but at the same time double down and keep on fighting for the dignity and respect for ALL people, for everyone EXCEPT the HATERS. I show no mercy or understanding or give any effort at all to see their point of view.

    ACT UP! Fight Back! For every shitty research study which is done to hurt never to help, tear it down. Go after it, do not let any of it stand unchallenged. We are DONE with the era where sexual minorities are smeared with lies, “all gay men are pedophiles,” remember that one? Now the Christian right has moved onto ppl who are transgender, the tiniest minority in the already small LGBT minority. All for one and one for all, united we stand, divided we fall.

    I do know one thing, when the tiny western LGBT minority and their supporters went after Russia for the Sochi Olympics we F-ed that up. We snatched gay hating Putin’s big world stage and put him down. I do believe we need to get to work harder in Brazil. Google translate is our friend. I’m done writing this comment but I am still enraged and I am going to fight.

    Liked by 2 people

    • The Pink Agendist
      October 28, 2018

      The GGB (which I believe is the oldest gay association in Latin America) runs a page called https://homofobiamata.wordpress.com/ where they keep the world up to date on LGBT attacks, deaths, legislation, the lot. They’re also on FB. The two people in charge Luiz Mott the president of the GGB and Eduardo Michels who’s a researcher. They both do exceptional work.

      Liked by 2 people

  21. And I hope you are doing better Pink. I could never understand you in certain ways. I could not relate to you, I didn’t know anybody like you. I could never understand why/how you couldn’t “just get over it.” Why are you still agonizing over your childhood when my God aren’t you 40 years old now? I truly never did understand why you couldn’t wouldn’t just move on and live in the present.

    Then you or a person on your blog explained it to me. It is like having a traumatic brain injury when you are a child and part of your brain (psyche) is damaged, blown away, gone. Sure you can go on living but you always have that brain injury. Once it was explained to me in physical terms I finally got it. I guess there is no cure but you can learn to compensate better, which is what I believe you are doing and I am PROUD of you for that Pink. You know if you were dumber, less intelligent, you would probably be a happier person. Your intellect is in a way a curse.

    Liked by 3 people

    • The Pink Agendist
      October 28, 2018

      Thanks 🙂
      Here’s a really wonderful article that explains a lot: http://www.dana.org/Cerebrum/2000/Wounds_That_Time_Won%E2%80%99t_Heal__The_Neurobiology_of_Child_Abuse/

      Liked by 3 people

      • inspiredbythedivine1
        October 28, 2018

        Thanks for posting this link. If you’e ever up for a long read on the damage caused by long-term child abuse, trauma and the treatment of it, check out a book called The Haunted Self: Structural Dissociation and the Treatment of Chronic Traumatization by Otto van der Hart, Kathy Steele, and Ellert R.S. Nijenhuis. The work of these writers/therapists literally helped to save my life. Their work explained to my overly critical and skeptical, and overly self-blaming, mind what abuse actually does to the developing mind and how severe and, in many cases, irreparable the damage can be. A trauma therapist I’ve worked with for over a decade introduced me to their work. it’s on Amazon here in the States and I’m sure you can find it easily. Otto van der Hart and Kathy Steele have done truly outstanding work in this field, and, like I said, it’s professionally written and put together so my skeptical mind found it enlightening. (Sorry for the long comment. This topic is one that effects me greatly, and I’ve spent almost half my life learning about it as a survival method.)

        Liked by 2 people

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 28, 2018

        I’ll order it now. I started reading about the issue after your last comments on this topic and suddenly a lot of things made sense to me. I think part of the problem is people have very narrow, almost afternoon-movie definitions of what abuse is (and its consequences.) And I think it’s hard for some people to grasp the magnitude of what it’s like to be taught to hate yourself.
        Now I’m rambling. Anyway, thank you for pointing me in this direction. It’s been enlightening.

        Liked by 2 people

      • inspiredbythedivine1
        October 29, 2018

        Yes. Very true. And when the recipient of abuse unfortunately holds that same narrow view, “It’s all MY fault this happened and is happening,” it makes any sort of healing for that person very difficult indeed. That’s were this type of research and work comes in handy for me. I’m sure you’ll get much out of the book. Let me know what you think of it.

        Liked by 1 person

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 29, 2018

        I guess it’s impossible not to blame the self, isn’t it? If I had been more interesting, smarter, better looking, heterosexual. If I had been, if I had been.

        Liked by 1 person

      • inspiredbythedivine1
        October 29, 2018

        Absolutely. And the shame of believing YOU are the one who is abnormal and wrong. I struggle with that shit every day, and cognitively I KNOW better.

        Liked by 1 person

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 28, 2018

        P.S. YOU BASTARD! THE BOOK IS £30 (GBP)

        Liked by 3 people

      • inspiredbythedivine1
        October 29, 2018

        Really? Well, it is a text book. Sorry. It wasn’t that much when I first bought it. I paid 20 or 25 American dollars for it, I believe. Look up the authors of the book. You should find several articles by them online on the subject. IMO, they’re the “experts” in this particular field of psychology.

        Liked by 1 person

      • Esme upon the Cloud
        October 31, 2018

        Incredibly useful link Mr Pink. Thank you.

        – Esme Cloud

        Liked by 1 person

  22. violetwisp
    October 28, 2018

    Oh, this is so depressing! I’m trying to avoid the news but had to read about the mess in Brazil and now find out he’s even worse than I thought, plus just watched a Stephen Fry interview with him and he seems properly unhinged and not bright. Like a brick, the Great Author says. And, on top of all that, I had to skim read more rants from Tildeb on the way. I’m impressed with your calm.

    Liked by 1 person

    • The Pink Agendist
      October 28, 2018

      I think the magnitude of what’s happening hasn’t quite dawned on anyone yet. Especially not on people who don’t understand Brazil’s history with dictatorship, the military and police abuses. Things can get very bad, very quickly.

      Like

    • john zande
      October 29, 2018

      He is dangerously stupid. Literally, dumb.

      Liked by 1 person

      • Sirius Bizinus
        October 30, 2018

        BTW, is everything okay on your end down there, JZ?

        I’ve been meaning to ask. The news coming out of Brazil has been dismal to say the least.

        Liked by 2 people

      • john zande
        October 30, 2018

        No problems here, but thanks for asking. The Paraíba Valley is relaxed.

        Liked by 3 people

  23. Sirius Bizinus
    October 29, 2018

    It looks like Brazilian society has some developing to do. There’s no sense in Bolsonaro’s candidacy, in what he says, in what he allegedly stands for. I first heard about it on “Last Week Tonight,” and Bolsonaro’s supporters found the clip and were trolling the threads in Portuguese. Some of them knew enough English to make death threats.

    The sad thing is that the entire idea of “dead is better than gay” would not be internalized but for the ensuing confirmation or silence by everyone else. Under better circumstances, anyone talking like Bolsonaro could get dismissed because no one would have to pretend to take it seriously. But then things like Bolsonaro getting elected demonstrate the ability for people to take leave of their senses en masse.

    Personally, I hope that any Brazilian threatened by this jackass or his supporters can get out of the country and find safe haven elsewhere. In the real world, being gay just describes one aspect of a human being’s life. The Bolsonaros of the world live in their imaginations, and they should be the ones to have to pay the price for it.

    Liked by 2 people

    • The Pink Agendist
      October 29, 2018

      “The sad thing is that the entire idea of ‘dead is better than gay’ would not be internalized but for the ensuing confirmation or silence by everyone else.”

      Absolutely. When I was breaking off with my family 20 years ago and explaining the damage of the homophobic discourse my grandfather directed towards me, my aunt said “He’s not a psychologist, you know” – I’ll never forget that line because of everything it implies. As if homophobia is expected and normal unless someone spends four years at university getting a degree in psychology. As if the onus is on the gay person to accept homophobia as if it’s deserved – justified.
      The biggest danger I see right now is that violence generates violence. If he puts the army into the slums as he’s promised we’re looking at what might become a bloodbath of dramatic proportions.

      Liked by 1 person

      • john zande
        October 29, 2018

        And he’ll have the tacit backing of most people in Rio. More than anyone else, they’re fed up. The Olympics was just a scam, and the crime there is now beyond all comprehension. They’re desperate, and that’s what’s driven their vote. Elsewhere, it’s just the sheer scale of the corruption perpetrated by PT. And Haddad did himself no favours by saying the first thing he’d do on becoming president would be to release Lula. He even went as far as saying Lula would walk up the Planalto ramp with him at his innauguration. Talk about being tone deaf!

        Liked by 1 person

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 29, 2018

        The corruption angle is very interesting. All those big companies that were involved (Odebrecht, OAS etc.) those aren’t companies owned and directed by “PT” related families. We’re talking old school elite. OAS belonged to the son in law of Antonio Carlos Magalhaes, late head of one of Bahia’s oldest (right wing) political dynasties. The Odebrechts and everyone working for them were part of the classic high society crowd. Not a leftists among them. So it’ll be interesting to see how the regrouping will take place as to now support Bolsonaro and yet again bleed the public coffers dry 😉

        Like

      • john zande
        October 29, 2018

        Thoroughly agree. Corruption is endemic. You enter politics here to legitimise (and enhance) your existing criminal activity. PT, though, oversaw a level that has even shocked Brazilians, which is saying something. 16 years, they’re getting the blame for everything.

        Honestly, the only solution i see is this: annul all political parties wholesale and the Constitution. Insert a professional caretaker government run by Australians and New Zealanders for 5 to 7 years. Rewrite the Constitution, and start again with a parliamentary system. I might even entertain re-inserting the monarchy to act as symbolic head of state, acting much like Elizabeth: the quiet grandmother who stays out of your hair but will bring fire down on your ass if you get too far out of line.

        Liked by 1 person

      • The Pink Agendist
        October 29, 2018

        It shocked Brazilians because we’re in the age of information. The same thing happened before, except no one knew about it. Also, it was done much more elegantly with the discreet exchange of artwork which had no traceable history – like religious art and highly important silver.
        The biggest difference with the PT is suddenly inexperienced corrupt people were involved. The kind that didn’t quite know what they were doing.

        Liked by 1 person

      • john zande
        October 29, 2018

        It was a free-for-all, coupled to fiscal/monetary imcompetency. Such a shame, because when I first arrived (in FHC’s last year) the country was awash with positivity. It was really quite exciting, but of course, that admin was corrupt, too.

        Like

  24. Joshua Ryan "Jammer" Smith
    November 3, 2018

    I really wish I had read this when I was younger and still in the closet. My parents weren’t homophobes, but I was often surrounded by people who more or less conveyed this attitude. Thank you man, this was beautiful.

    Liked by 2 people

    • The Pink Agendist
      November 3, 2018

      And I wish I’d known it when I was younger 🙂

      Liked by 1 person

      • Joshua Ryan "Jammer" Smith
        November 3, 2018

        I mean did you have any sort of emotional support network at all? Just out of curiosity? I did when I came out, but I was 26 by then so I’d made enough friends it wouldn’t have been too much of an issue.

        Liked by 1 person

      • The Pink Agendist
        November 3, 2018

        Not really. I just accepted solitude was my only option. And once that sets in, it becomes the only way one knows how to be.

        Liked by 1 person

  25. thegaycastaway
    November 4, 2018

    I’ve been trying to unpack this very thing and how it has negatively affected me.
    Growing up in Bermuda did its damage and it is still an ugly place to be gay.
    Thanks for writing, more articulately than I, how this affects people.

    Liked by 1 person

    • The Pink Agendist
      November 4, 2018

      I’ve spent a long time trying to figure out how to say it myself. There’s a side of all of us, I think, that attaches itself to the silence. As if not saying it out loud means it didn’t really happen.

      Liked by 1 person

  26. IkhonaCoffeeContemplations
    November 16, 2018

    Reblogged this on Ikhona Coffee Contemplations and commented:
    Topics that need to become normalized in society.

    Liked by 1 person

  27. theoccasionalman
    December 17, 2018

    Social media use has been difficult for me since the election. I didn’t think through how many of my Brazilian friends are conservatives, and the election of the ‘Tropical Trump’ gives them permission to be really mean-spirited about groups who differ from them. One guy posted that he tried to think of something he hated worse than the left, but couldn’t come up with anything. His wife responded, “People who vote on the left?” I realized that the connection between conservative politics and religion is making it harder and harder for me to interact with large groups of people I used to be close to. Life seems to be a series of closing doors, and we lose and we lose and we lose.

    Liked by 1 person

    • The Pink Agendist
      December 17, 2018

      It opened my eyes in the worst possible way.

      P.S. Thank you, because this post would not have been written without your help. Reading your notes and how magnificently well organised they were gave me a bit of much needed clarity.

      Liked by 1 person

    • john zande
      December 17, 2018

      Are you in Brazil?

      Liked by 1 person

  28. theoccasionalman
    December 18, 2018

    ^^ What he said. 1999-2001, then I went back for two weeks in 2014. In our late teens/early twenties, everyone/everything seemed fantastic and supportive and adaptive. Over time, people solidify their beliefs and concepts, and as potential has become actual, I’ve become very different from them, but I still love them enough to be hurt by them.

    Liked by 1 person

  29. pinkagendist
    December 18, 2018

    Reblogged this on The Pink Agendist and commented:
    From my new blog:
    “I’d rather have a dead son than a gay son.
    Let that phrase wash over you. Let it envelop you. Let it sink in. Taste its bitter sting. A dead son, is better, than a gay son. Dead better than gay.
    Now imagine being a child hearing that: a little boy who’s just that little bit different from the other little boys. The way he walks is just that little bit different; the way he talks is just that little bit different – even the way he crosses his legs is just that little bit different, just enough that it makes him stand out.”

    Like

  30. Carl D'Agostino
    December 18, 2018

    Don’t mean to minimize the matter of this vibrantly discussed subject. I deal on a different plane. Both my children are democrats. Oy vey.

    Like

  31. Fran Macilvey
    December 19, 2018

    Hello! 🙂 It’s great to have a post from you land in my ‘in’ box. I hope you are well.

    Yes, this guy is a stinker. Thankfully, the young people I know (and encourage, hopefully, to live kindly) are liberal, funny, relaxed and open about their sexuality. Prejudice affects everyone: gay, straight, lesbian, intersex and others. And it leaves those who pedal cruel and divisive politics with a lot to explain.

    I also feel that those who speak cruelly of others are terrified of something – perhaps of being found out – and so, I also feel sorry for their mind-limiting and linear thinking. They miss out on the full expression of love.

    Lots of love,

    Fran xxx ♥

    Liked by 1 person

    • The Pink Agendist
      December 19, 2018

      Hi!!!
      It’s been ages, how have you been? I clicked on your name and you’re not on WP any more. Why????

      Liked by 1 person

  32. Fran Macilvey
    December 20, 2018

    Hi PA – I’ve got my own website at https://www.franmacilvey.com, (which I think is hosted by WordPress).

    You can follow blog posts there by clicking on the RSS feed. But I’m just so happy to be following you now, and pleased to get regular updates. I’ll do my best to stay in touch with you. :-)))

    Take care, and happy Festive season. xx

    Liked by 1 person

  33. Judi Castille
    December 26, 2018

    I have been away for almost a year tending to my terminally ill mother. She died a bitter, self centred bigot to the end. I can say with honesty I hated her. It’s a strong word but her life was one of intolerance and prejudice. My childhood had been one of bullying due to a face deformity. I have felt the sting of words.

    Today I am glad I have no cares as to what people look like, believe in, aspire too, follow their gender longings or sometimes in rash moments do rash things. It is still shocking that in this world people still assume righteousness in beliefs that hurt, limit freedom or in extreme cases, cause death of an innocent.
    All I can say is at whatever given judgement day you believe in and I am an athiest for my troubles, live your life with honesty, be charitable, have empathy and doing good where you can. What’s inside you that looks after you is what matters. It’s good we can share our visions now with openness. Not always possible in every country but I believe we are heading in the right direction. Happy 2019.

    Liked by 1 person

    • The Pink Agendist
      December 27, 2018

      I can’t tell you how wonderfully refreshing it is to read a comment like yours. People are usually so concerned with appearing to fit into that romantic myth of the idealised family they can’t bear to be honest about how they really feel and what they genuinely lived through.

      Liked by 1 person

  34. Judi Castille
    December 26, 2018

    Sorry I replied twice. Shakey middle aged fingers!

    Liked by 1 person

  35. charliesroadtofame
    December 29, 2018

    Such a deep post.
    Makes me feel lucky and blessed to have come out to a great family,
    You write beautifully.
    Followed. Have a great new year!

    Liked by 1 person

  36. aaronlife
    January 7, 2019

    Your writing is so inspiring and it breaks my heart that the world is like this. I live in a small Northern town and had to be re-housed twice by police in 4 years (in addition to dealing with agoraphobia and depression)..all because I live with my boyfriend. This is in a so-called liberal and tolerant part of the world. I actually with someone else who commented, the best revenge is trying to be a good human being – kind, empathetic and not full of the bile of the intolerant. The rise of the far right is disturbing but not entirely surprising sadly 😦

    Liked by 1 person

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This entry was posted on October 26, 2018 by in activism, gay and tagged , , , , , .
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